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 Marcus Stephenson gone from THQ. Also, topic: WWE '12, Does it still hold up, or is it a huge disapointment at this point?

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Satori2.0



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PostSubject: Marcus Stephenson gone from THQ. Also, topic: WWE '12, Does it still hold up, or is it a huge disapointment at this point?   Wed Apr 11, 2012 7:23 pm

I'll be brief about the first aspect, regarding Marcus.

Marcus Stepenson, is gone from WWE Games once again. He was the guy that was mainly taking fans ideas and concepts in and putting them on the table to get them into the last 2 games, and was also the biggest source of up-to-date news. Essentially he was the two-way speaker that we was giving all our feedback to, which he took and tried to manage to get the production of the game with what people wanted most layed out and put in.

Frankly, the thought of this aspect being gone always worries me the most, as it'll just be a return to the "dark ages" of the PS2 games where they didn't have a community to listen to, no one to take feedback and try to apply it to, and THQ always just did whatever they wanted, their customer suggestions be dammed. I don't think anyone, least of all myself, want a return to the days of us not having any voice towards the final product.

But as you've heard, probably, THQ is facing massive problems with money right now, and others in the industry keep waiting for THQ to go completely bankrupt as a company, soon. They have been in danger of being de-listed from the stock exchange for a while now and are undergoing MASSIVE lay-offs.

Honestly though, it's not at all because of their wrestling and UFC sports titles. In fact, those are the only thing that is keeping them holding on right now, and that consistently sell well. Their WWE licence is by far the strongest thing they have that is making them money right now, with their UFC titles being probably second place.

THQ, however, are also responsible for a lot of terrible kids games like their line of bargain bin Spongebob games, the disastrous U-Draw (which nearly put them firmly in bankruptcy on it's own.) and failed attempts at new franchises that have bombed miserably and shot them in the foot.

But this leads me to think back on WWE '12. Y'know, that game I was IMMENSELY HYPED about and couldn't shut up about, and talked about constantly? The game has been out for a long time now, and looking back on it, brings me to this question...

Has WWE '12 held up well until now, or is it a massive disappointment?

Honestly, I think that now, it's a massive disappointment. I might be alone in this, but I honestly feel like the epic failure of these godawful fucking servers have singlehandedly dragged this game down into being a giant waste of time.

My feelings now is that WWE '12 had a good foundation and was fun for a few weeks, and it's obvious to me that what they were REALLY counting on, to make this game hold up past the initial 3 month experience was supposed to be the community creations and replay value. And in that important regard, the game is a massive, crashing failure.

WWE '12 was SUPPOSED to be that game that was the simulation game you play all year round, the game you never get tired of, and the game that doesn't get old. It got old after the first 2 months, because the server was supposed to be the thing to keep the game afloat, and I don't think it's an exaggeration to honestly say that this game has the worst, most unstable, completely broken and absolutely unusable online server of any commercial video game ever released into the market.

WWE '12's whole make-or-break aspect was it's replay value, and as it turns out, the game has almost none. I've recently seen 10 copies of WWE '12 at a used game store I go to. 10 copies. It's like people are just throwing this game away, now, and I don't blame them. This leads me to believe, when I stop and think about where THQ is right now, and the massive failure of this game's most important community-based aspect, that WWE '13 isn't going to be worth even looking forward to, if THQ even exists for much longer to even make another game.

Frankly, i'm not excited, and don't think I care about the next game that much. And this was a series I looked forward to, every year.

But let's face it, they've had at least 4 years and several past games to get a workable online server right, and they've failed at it every time, when every year, they claimed this was going to be the game to get it working right. This series has no longevity, and it's supposed to be based around longevity, being a sim game and all.

THQ, this year, isn't even going to have the money or budget to waste on hiring community managers or put up poll's or get feedback or even advertize that much, let alone be able to put enough into the game to separate it from last years. They're laying off people, and the game is undoubtedly going to suffer for it.

There's no way that 13 is going to be able make as good of a game as WWE '12. But since WWE '12 is already a disappointment on it's own, and couldn't even hold up past the 2 months after it's release date, that is in no way a good thing. The game lost all it's re-playability way before all the DLC even came out. And that, combined with the number of used copies clogging up shelves more than any other game I see, also speaks very badly for it.

I have little to no hopes of WWE '13 being even worth the purchase, if it somehow survives the cancellation announcement that I predict is coming soon. I already have no desire to look forward to it again, or to bother pre-ordering it. I'm so wary of this game not being very good, due to the current THQ financial situation, and of the servers being the same broken bullshit AGAIN, that I'm not going to buy 13 until it's out for 2 weeks, and I've heard concrete proof from forums or websites that the game works like it's supposed to.

I feel terrible coming to this conclusion, as I never thought i'd really lose hope in, what is honestly, my favorite current video game franchise for the last decade. But I have, now. WWE '13 better really prove to me why I should buy it this time, because I don't want to end up with another $60 game that's not worth playing anymore after half a month.
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PostSubject: Re: Marcus Stephenson gone from THQ. Also, topic: WWE '12, Does it still hold up, or is it a huge disapointment at this point?   Wed Apr 11, 2012 10:48 pm

I'll post a full reply to this tonight with som detailed thoughts. But for now I'll just say that while I agree with the criticism of the online servers, and do think it damaged the game, I dont agree the game has no replay value, or that they made it a disappointment. I think WWE12 is a very good and very playable game, I still play it a lot now, and I looking forward to WWE13.

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PostSubject: Re: Marcus Stephenson gone from THQ. Also, topic: WWE '12, Does it still hold up, or is it a huge disapointment at this point?   Thu Apr 12, 2012 3:19 am

I haven't played this game in a long time, although after seeing this thread I'll probably go back to it, since I finished TimeSplitters for a while yesterday.

I think that saying the entire game is a complete failure based on the community sharing servers being shit is an exaggeration. Sounds more like you were trying to download something, got frustrated cos you couldn't download it and suddenly the whole game is shit...

I hardly ever downloaded community creations on it so with regards to my general gaming experience your point is moot. It's a good game. While I know it's not perfect, it's about as close to a full customisable wrestling sim as we have so far. For e-fedding communities like ours, this is like, the perfect game. Create a brand, create a show, create an arena, create a wrestler, tag team, entrance, finishing move... The only limitations are your own imagination and length of concentration. That's more than can be said for a lot of games.

That's not to say I don't see your point. People love online modes, sharing and downloading and playing against each other but I don't think it's like a make-or-break point for success. There's so much more to the game than that.

I'll probably get WWE '13, I'd imagine they'll put some more stuff requested for this year in it, and we'll all excited about it and get keen for it and buy it. I'm not like, waiting eagerly for it but like I said, I'll most likely buy it.
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PostSubject: Re: Marcus Stephenson gone from THQ. Also, topic: WWE '12, Does it still hold up, or is it a huge disapointment at this point?   Thu Apr 12, 2012 4:51 am

Well, to clarify the point I was trying to make better, I wasn't at all saying that the entire game was shit becuase of the server issue...

I was saying that any replaybility that the game had past the initial 3 month experience after everything had been done in single player, was completely destroyed and there's no reason at all to play the game further than that.

Especially when THQ's main goal past that initial three months as a simulation game was supposed to be about people playing it year round.

As is pretty evident, no one has been playing this game past that time and a great many people are returning the game as well instead of it being the extended simulation experience it was meant to be, so that their plan to keep people playing the game after the novelty wears off was a complete failure.

It's a great game for a month. Maybe two. But as the full year playable simulation that was intended and meant to be a long-lasting experience, it's an absolutely phenomenal screwup. There's nothing to do in this game, anymore. I did it all. And now I feel apathy for the game. The problem I have now, was that this quick boredom with WWE 12 is what THQ was trying to avoid with this game. They eventually came nothing close to their goal because of the ratshit servers.

Loved this game for a short while, but wouldn't really touch it with a ten-foot pole, now. Hence my feelings here in April 2012 are vastly different than my feelings were in November 2011.

I can already see WWE '13 being more of the same, again. Because this is a repeat of SvR11's same replay issues, which was a repeat of SvR10's replay issues, which is a repeat of SvR09's replay issues.
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PostSubject: Re: Marcus Stephenson gone from THQ. Also, topic: WWE '12, Does it still hold up, or is it a huge disapointment at this point?   Thu Apr 12, 2012 8:34 am

I don't agree with your view on the long-term playability. Not at all.

The playability in WWE12 comes from booking your own angles and story lines as the Universe mode progresses, seeing new storyline feuds develop, choosing to elevate certain people, choosing to hold down others. Having access to community creations to update the roster is nice, but its by no means an essential element to the game. In fact, weren't you one of the ones who wanted to populate your game with original CAWs and not worry about have a realistic roster?

Personally, I don't give a rats ass that Kane is in his old look, or that I don't have Ryback and Tensai and a new look Undertaker. I don't really care about having a complete attitude era or ECW or WCW roster either. Its plenty fun with the combination of people that are on the game, and the CAWs I make myself. In fact, I've now taken to making completely new guys and introducing them as new WWE recruits. Plenty of long-term playability in that.

If having an updated roster matters that much, make your own CAWs. Relying on other people to make them takes away much of the additional fun and long-term playability you crave. Its much more interesting to make your own guys.

Additionally, I don't agree that no-one is playing the game now. I am, for a start, and the presence of new CAWs such as petchy's Lord Tensai suggest other people are as well.

To say replay value is completely destroyed is, I'm sorry, barking. There's plenty to do longer term if you are prepared to inject some of your own imagination into it.

As I say, I agree the servers have been a joke and a huge disappointment. Its clearly something THQ have failed on. I agree that in some ways it weakens the game long term. But destroy it, no, not at all, IMO.

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PostSubject: Re: Marcus Stephenson gone from THQ. Also, topic: WWE '12, Does it still hold up, or is it a huge disapointment at this point?   Thu Apr 12, 2012 10:54 am

To be honest the server wouldn't put me off buying it. Like DS for me the replay value comes in the story and my own characters. Sure, other people people might get a better version but I like my versions.

It's still on my list to buy, at some point.
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